First of all I am extremely happy that most of my friends who were earlier
disinterested in politics and somehow with the doings in the country itself have
now jumped into such good conversations around the issue. It’s a welcome sign
that things are changing and though we may be on different sides as of now we
all aspire for a change and if u and me both aspire for it then change is eminent.
It is also refreshing to debate for subjects which the young and old both has
been aspiring rather than the fake debates of communal versus secular …now
getting to the actual debate.
Chandan if u see my comment on another of AAP supporter’s page u will see I
mentioned how delighted I am that the people of Delhi such a mandate in favor
of AAP and how such an idealistic kind of politics will go a long way in
cleaning the whole system. In fact the first sign of change has already started
showing with none of the parties making a claim to form govt in Delhi, Rahul
Gandhi accepting that somewhere something is not working and he needs to bring
changes in congress on line of AAP,isn’t that a great thing ?However my
acceptance of their doing good has been ignored in your comments and other AAP
supporters as well.
While change in one party is good I was happy and I debated that how BJP
was well poised to take on the challenge of AAP being more federal in structure
instead of being run by a dynastic family. A party where decisions are taken by
a group of people rather than a single person. A party where the PRESSURE FROM CADRE yes read it again
very well pressure by cadre which holds no post anywhere in this country forced
the president of the party to declare Modi as the Prime Ministerial candidate.
Unfortunately your definition of common man has become too centered on AAP and
somehow you are not looking at anyone out of AAP as a common man.
COMPETITVE POLITICS
The other high point of my arguments was that of COMPETITVE POLITICS. While I appreciated the changes that AAP is
forcing on the political scene I tried to extend the argument further than the
events are harbinger of change in other parties also. And if that happen it
will be great for Indian democracy. Will it or Not? I cannot predict whether
AAP will come in power at the national scene but I can bet a thousand times that
if competitive politics bring a change in the way each party works that will be
beneficial to generations to come. Unfortunately you are looking extremely
uncomfortable with the idea that there can be any other party which can also
change and can pose a challenge. I strongly disagree with you on this front.
Whether a party remains or is forgotten what is important that change must
happen for the good. Today BJP is well poised for challenging AAP tomorrow
congress may also be able to do that. With all my love for my party BJP I have
an eye to look at the good of other parties (even in congress ...yes even they have some strengths J ) and also to look at the folly of my own party
and I wish my friends who have acquired a taste in politics to not get
impatient with any criticism and agree that there are good reasons that these
party have been voted for so long in power. Unfortunately as of now you are not
looking.
SAB KE SAB CHOR HAIN
I have one thing where I strongly differ from the founder of AAP and one of
the foundation on which AAP is based. That is his idea of sab ke sab chor hain.
All of the political parties were formed for a reason based firmly on ideology
rather than greed. Let me walk through some examples While we all know that
Congress was the only party which existed at the time of independence and
everyone rallied behind its leaders to attain the common good of all. While it
has lost its sight on change today and have surrendered itself the decisions of
a single family some of the heroes we worship today were from congress.
Therefore we shout in favor of Patel (he lived for 2-3 years after
independence) as much as any of our own leader in BJP. Mahatma remains to me
the tallest of all humans I have read or seen, Shastri (around a year of tenure) remains my favorite
PM along with Vajpayee. And yes Nehru had a personality which everyone envied
and desired, his understanding of the subjects had the depth and understanding
which few had in his time and it is not just me it’s in my party leaders and
even other party leaders to acknowledge the good work and the stature of
leaders from other party, it was none other than Vajpayee who called Indira as
Durga after the win against Bangladesh in 1971.And it was none other than Nehru
who introduced Vajpayee as the future PM of India. AAP needs to go a long way
to pick this culture, sab ke sab chor hain might be a way of venting out my
anger temporarily but definitely it’s not going to take us anywhere.
Even other parties from Mayawati, Lallu , paswan ,Mulayam, NTR, DMK, AIDMK
,Left had reasons to exist. Some gave voice to the marginalized other gave voice
to regional aspirations. Some were based on socialist values others were based
on economic principles. And yes they all brought a change for this day to come
when we can desire for more. And desire is not sin as nation mature the agendas
will change yesterday it was about survival for dalits which gave people like
lallu and mayawati a chance to run the govt so today it is governance and corruption.
Agendas will never remain the same today what is dear to you may not remain an
agenda at all in sometime. What became the reason of their rise became the
reason of their fall. When survival was important they won and forgot that once
people get voice they like to have growth. Tomorrow when they will have growth
they may desire something else, elections in west have agendas which may look
quite absurd to us today. And tomorrow when the agendas may change only those
who are willing to change will survive, when communist failed in Russia so did
the ability of left to govern India became dim. ManMohan Singh has presided
over some of the greatest changes of our current history he was the finance
minister when the economy took a u turn and he is the prime minister when the
politics of the country is going through tectonic shift. It is the complete
misrule and absence of any sense of governance that has set the mood of such
despondency and utter helplessness and it is in that context that AAP is born.
Since it is born out of this despair and hopeless scene it is definitely giving
a voice to this change better than anyone else. But then others are fast
catching up and bet me if in next elections we get a govt which works for
governance and growth the foundation on which AAP is standing will lose ground.
Good times have the ability to make bad time forgot easily. The cynicism which
we are witnessing will fail to find ground and the rules of the game will
change again if a party promising of governance come in power and performs well.
And if it does not then AAP may further add to its tally. But if change indeed
happens for good then AAP will have to change with the changing agendas a
failure to do so might be suicidal. As of now AAP has little agenda except
anti-corruption and I am not doubting their ability to come up with new agenda
with changing times but since they don’t have the agenda I cannot either agree
that it exist
Coming to your specific questions
1. Now no Diggi will EVERRR
dare to underestimate and challenge a common man.
2. An year back, who would’ve imagined that that an election can be fought with transparent money?
3. An year back, who would’ve imagined that the lordship of two well established parties can be challenged by unknown faces?
2. An year back, who would’ve imagined that that an election can be fought with transparent money?
3. An year back, who would’ve imagined that the lordship of two well established parties can be challenged by unknown faces?
All parties were at some point of time started with an emotional issue ,
shyama prasad mukhjee gave his life to enter Kashmir , when unity was an emotional
issue people died for that. When governance have become an issue Kejriwal has
taken a stand and I welcome that this is happening. BJP grew from 2 seats to
the ruling party and opposition; it challenged the lordship of a single party.
Who would have invested in it at that point of time? Collecting funds was as
difficult at their time when even the enlightened NRI’s didn’t exist.
Mobilization of resources was as difficult when democracy was crushed by indira
gandhi and Jayaprakash narayan and other members of all political party came
together to give hope. Yes all the ones who you call chor and power hungry. And
this is not new news but I needed to tell you since neither do you read
newspaper nor were we born to have witnessed the same. And when the rules of
the game changed BJP moved to more progressive agendas like governance long
before kejriwal came into picture. They have responded for change and that’s
where I admire them, they have shown the flexibility and that why they are
surviving. And they have not changed in words we have seen the growth in parts
of the country where they have governed and people threw them the place where
they messed up. They have shown how can a party move from one leader to another
after a generational shift and have not depended on one leader for their
survival. AAP is as of today totally dependent on kejriwal , democracy is yet
to take birth and show its tantrums in AAP , it will raise it head in coming time.
But again that does not take away the credit from them what they doing and
common man is indeed giving them a long rope but then no rope is ever unending.
4. An year back, who would’ve
thought that a party with no high-command can perform? Who would’ve thought
that these young minds would come up with such an innovative idea like Call
Delhi, campaigning at Railway stations, Human hoardings, Campaigning in Auto,
Campaigning on social media etc? Who would have imagined they’ll be able to
carve one of the best Volunteer networks in the world in merely 6 months time.
If they can bring this much of innovation in their first move in democracy, why
can’t they bring innovation to propel India towards growth & get back its
lost credibility in recent years? On the other hand, what innovation did you
see on BJPs front other than chanting modi modi…??
You are unaware so let me tell you that all other parties also attract the
best of talent from different fields.BJP’s presence on social media , their
door to door poll strategy, use of technology to identify areas weak and
strong, Niti central their own version of online newspaper, YuvaTv their own
channel on youtube, live streaming of their rallies on youtube, google + chat
with their leaders , facebook presence , twitter responses, mission 272 website
and all this with regular personal to
personal programs .Then they have RSS which runs a range of social programs for
the marginalized. Again none of this takes away what AAP has achieved which is
extraordinary but then just because I don’t know doesn’t mean that it doesn’t
exist for others. And have you heard the innovations in gujrat with solar
panels on canals and separate set of power grids for industry and domestic use
which has resulted in 100 percent power in Gujarat. Have you heard of BRTS
where by investing the least money they have provided a service to the common
man to travel in the city. Is anyone of this can be counted as innovation or
not. If not then I can write the next response just in the name of the
innovations that have happened. The same has been replicated in other BJP ruled
states also. Right from the achievement of Vajpayee govt to Modi to shivraj Singh
Chauhan, and the first IITIAN to be chief minister “Manohar Parekh” innovation
is happening as I write this response.
5. Which party withdraws his
candidate after their self-finding about criminal charges against one of its
candidates? who would have imagined that one doesn’t need criminals to win
people's heart. Even now, can your party dare to expel all their criminal
candidates and promise that in future they will not give tickets to criminals?
I do not want to go in this debate but only yesterday an AAP MLA molested a
lady and he got a warning from kejriwal. And then they requested all MP’s and
MLA’s from other parties to join them. How do you explain it? When chors from
other party join AAP do they become saint? Some kind of baptism program is
going for these leaders? Also these things can’t be judged for a party so fresh
in nature it will take some years for test of these strengths.
6. Had AAP not won it like
this, think about how much mockery these political parties would have made of
us, the common man!
I am with you buddy and they have put a slap on everyone who mocked the
common man. Now they need to perform and that’s where I want them to show that
by doing it not just talking about it.
7. 6 months ago everybody
said, Kejriwal is going for an electoral suicide by choosing to go against 3
terms chief minister Sheila Dixit. Just think about it, one needs real courage
and self belief to dare something like this. I am sure even Harshvardhan in his
wildest dream can never dare this.
Buddy you need to start reading newspaper Sushma swaraj fought against
Sonia Gandhi and then made karnataka her home state till the time she learnt
kannada.Yes Sonia gandhi I am sure u
will find it more crazy than the Sheila dixit .Other parties may have done so
when they needed to prove the point I have not read enough about them.
8. I hear lot of people say
Kejriwal ditched Anna, if Kejriwal ditched Anna, why can’t we also assume that
Anna did no less to him…
I don’t know, a movement can be run by a political party and without a
political party. Lokpal still remains a dream in India as well as Delhi even
after people telling their choices in very clear words.
9. By the way, what is your
favorite parties' stand on the issues that you mentioned along with good
governance, corruption etc? What substantial steps BJP has taken in AP to
differ Congress on Telangana? What did they do when Yedurappa was looting Belllari?
Can they now assure there will not be any moist attack in Chattisgarh?
People wanted telengana so BJP supported that , earlier it supported
creation of Bihar and Jharkahnd, it supported creation of MP, chattsigarh and
they bifurcated in a way that none of the parties had bad feeling for the
parting state. Is that a difference or only shouting loud sab ke sab chor hain
is change.Yedurappa was removed from CM post and BJP lost, somehow same people
who want change gave his party 20 percent of vote in elections. People vote for
different reasons at different time.
10. Remember, when you chant
BJP BJP, its NOT MODI who is going to be the MP of all 276 seats... there are
going to be some criminals, some rapists, some murders, and some extortionist
in that? why should we not challenge this system? While I do believe in Modi's
ability, there are more NON-MODIs than MODIs in BJP.
It will happen with all parties when they will have millions of members, it’s
not an excuse however and it needs to be rectified and this is where
COMPETITIVE POLITICS come in play.
11. Last but not the least,
don’t get misguided by the results that people really loved your party in other
states, its just that they didn't have an HONEST alternative there
I think this is overconfidence. Dost every party face its day of loss and win,
AAP will also face it. It is part and parcel of the game. I am sure if AAP
really had sensed a point in MP, Rajasthan they would have gone for it. Kejriwal
is not that innocent crazy guy. He picked his place with good plan and kudos to
him for doing that. Now he needs to show me how is he different by giving a
good governance.
I think you need to come out
of your house to see how your house actually looks like. I am glad you are
doing it soon, I am pretty sure you'll have a different point of view then.
Good luck with your TimesOfIndia until then.
This is a good change that a lot of people who never took interest in
politics have now started caring for it and therefore your point of view that
we can do something has come into picture.A lot of us believed that India ka
kuch nahi ho sakta hai .. but I have always believed that “Yes we can” when
people rejected Anna movement I saw that as a change coming and even now I see
the living democracy working in India. You are just looking at AAP winning or
losing but I am trying to see beyond that.
And the house from where you are looking at your house .. us ghar ne
kaisyon ke ghar jalaye hain..don’t look at your country from others point of view.
We have unique challenges and unique solutions. Democracy does not even work in
such a lively manner anywhere on earth. It is in our DNA it just got
institutionalized in 1947
If AAP can do this miracle in
a matter of few months; they can have your mentioned issues (telangana,
kashmir, ambanis, employment etc) added in their agenda, what’s the bigg
deal..?? Just to remind you, in my opinion they are not against Ambanis, they
are against the unethical practices these bigger companies have been following
in India…so what? What’s wrong in being against it..?? If you can question
Robert Vadra for his unethical practices, why can’t Ambanis be questioned for
something similar? Why can't Ambanis be taught to run business like Google and
Facebook without indulging & encouraging a culture of bribe and corruption?
Do it that’s what I am asking for, don’t just tell me stories at prime
time.
I
wonder why and how impatient our so called ‘young generation’ has become. Why
do we flip our sides ‘so quickly’ and ‘so often’…?? One day we say Sachin must
retire, and the moment he scores even a fifty, we then say there is so much of
Cricket left in him, and finally we all cry Sachin Sachin! Why can’t we realize
we got to have a long term vision if we want to change the system from its
root? W...hile we criticize AAP and Kejriwal in the current scenario, why don’t
we think that:
I have not changed sides but you have taken
a side I am all for them to prove themselves but then at one place we start to
get restless that we need the change now and at the same time we want to fight
all elections and want everyone to vote for them even before they have proved their
worth in governance. Since you took the example of cricket let me explain that
don’t become like commentators who will explain you the game from 15 point of
view but will fail the minute they are put on ground. What’s the hurry for them
to win complete lok sabha even before they show what they are capable of doing
in Delhi?
1. What would happen to their credibility if they take support from Congress, and BJP. Wont the voters who voted for ‘unknown faces’ just because they so hated CONG and BJP feel cheated if AAP does so?
I have explained this before you don’t need
to take support from anyone. You can run a minority govt which no one will pull
down.Do you understand that first we need to agree on that.
2. Why is that a ‘power thirsty’ party like BJP, where Rajnath Singh & their senior party leaders were asserting just a day before that they ARREE going to form govt in all 4 states, took a UU turn all of a sudden, and started offering AAP to form govt? Are Indian Politicians so kind? Is it not a conspiracy to fool public by putting up a wrong image of their opponents, is it not Politics at its dirtiest?
2. Why is that a ‘power thirsty’ party like BJP, where Rajnath Singh & their senior party leaders were asserting just a day before that they ARREE going to form govt in all 4 states, took a UU turn all of a sudden, and started offering AAP to form govt? Are Indian Politicians so kind? Is it not a conspiracy to fool public by putting up a wrong image of their opponents, is it not Politics at its dirtiest?
When you fight a election you by default
become a player for power , you had raised the Anna point. You can call him as
someone who is trying to bring change by not being in power. Kejriwal choose
the other route so he is also playing the power game. Power hungry is a bull
shit term when you are fighting elections.(jayaprakash narayan and Gandhi could
come to this definition or anna in current scenario). In an electoral game you
fight to win election and bring the change. Did kejriwal not mention that they
will have complete sweep, is he not asking BJP to form govt though they don’t
have the majority.
3. Why, out of nowhere, BJP has now started saying that AAP should form a minority govt and pass the Lokpaal bill and other Agendas? BJP being the largest party, it is conceivable they would allow AAP to pass State Lokpal & other bills when it comes to voting for the Bill? In that case won’t AAP lose its credibility and Ground? Fir na to Party bachegi na Bill pass hoga? What would the common men do then?
3. Why, out of nowhere, BJP has now started saying that AAP should form a minority govt and pass the Lokpaal bill and other Agendas? BJP being the largest party, it is conceivable they would allow AAP to pass State Lokpal & other bills when it comes to voting for the Bill? In that case won’t AAP lose its credibility and Ground? Fir na to Party bachegi na Bill pass hoga? What would the common men do then?
BJP never said that (I am not sure) I said that.
This is childish if u get a good bill and the opposition opposes it they will
be taught a lesson by people. It will not be a loss of credibility but in fact
a point to prove that yes they can do. In fact if they are planning to run
loksabha elections it will allow them to concentrate on that instead of
focusing again on Delhi elections. Somehow you are thinking that whatever I am
suggesting is against them that are not true. If they prove themselves in 6
months they might pose a graver danger to other parties. Could anyone oppose
food security bill even though they knew that its huge expenditure and not a
good idea… no one wants to be identified as opposing a popular bill.
4. Have we forgotten how both Congress and BJP made a Mockery of ‘Democracy’ & ‘Public Sentiments’ in the last winter session when they were “ACTING” to be attempting to pass the Lokpal bill? On what ground CONG & BJP should be trusted again?
4. Have we forgotten how both Congress and BJP made a Mockery of ‘Democracy’ & ‘Public Sentiments’ in the last winter session when they were “ACTING” to be attempting to pass the Lokpal bill? On what ground CONG & BJP should be trusted again?
These are arguments from past, now AAP is
in power. Pass it and resign else fall while trying to pass it.You can pass it
without trusting them. Put the ball in their court by bringing the bill.
5. If AAP is not accepting BJPs suspiciously illicit offer, why is BJP portraying it as if AAP is committing a CRIME? What’s the big deal in going for a reelection if we want to live in a peace of mind for next 5 years? It is not going to be the first re-election in Indian Democracy, both cong and BJP have done it in the past.
5. If AAP is not accepting BJPs suspiciously illicit offer, why is BJP portraying it as if AAP is committing a CRIME? What’s the big deal in going for a reelection if we want to live in a peace of mind for next 5 years? It is not going to be the first re-election in Indian Democracy, both cong and BJP have done it in the past.
That’s no crime neither did anyone said
like that. Let them do that if that’s the fate it is my personal opinion that
they should go for governance route and prove rather than without that experience.
6. Why have we forgotten BJP-JDU did the same thing in Bihar when a hung up assembly was caused by Ramvilas Paswan? They then came with a clear majority in the re-poll and thus were able to do some really good progress in Bihar. Imagine if there wouldn’t have been a re-elections, Paswan-Lalu would have been shitting on their heads all the time not allowing them to do anything. O God! that would have been a nightmare! Is BJP not trying something similar with AAP?
Bihar is an incorrect example in this case.
When that happened, Bihar was at its lowest point in current history. Men were
kidnapped in broad day light. There was no industry, no growth, no law and
order … absolutely nothing. Supreme Court had called it the JUNGLE RAJ. By not
giving a government in that state it was still better than the govt people were
used to. Delhi by that accounts was a well governed state with metro, roads and
a thriving industry. However Sheila Dixit was a 3 times chief minister and the
spillover of the central govt misdeeds, her own image after common wealth games
and nirbhaya had its ripple effect in
Delhi. It will be a challenge for any party to bring a sense of change in a
city which is usually quite well governed being the capital of the country. Leaving
that city bhagwan bharose will be hugely unpopular where industry, growth and
other things will get impacted. You just can’t leave a city which contributes 3
percent to India’s GDP without governance. People there are impatient believe
me.And tht’s why I am of that opinion.
7. Why is BJP giving it a shade that taxpayer’s money will go in vain? It takes 40 crores for reelections in Delhi, and this money is nothing as compared to what BJP have looted in Bellary? If they are so much concern about taxpayers money can they promise they will seize Yedurappa’s property and return a part of it back to Indian Govt? Moreover isn’t this money is worth spending for a 5 years stable honest government?
7. Why is BJP giving it a shade that taxpayer’s money will go in vain? It takes 40 crores for reelections in Delhi, and this money is nothing as compared to what BJP have looted in Bellary? If they are so much concern about taxpayers money can they promise they will seize Yedurappa’s property and return a part of it back to Indian Govt? Moreover isn’t this money is worth spending for a 5 years stable honest government?
Don’t know if BJP said that, they said they
are ready to sit in opposition or face reelection. Kejriwal suggested that BJP
and congress join hand Harsh vardhan didn’t suggested that. Congress extended
support to AAP. If re-elections are the route let it be nobody cares?
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